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Author Topic: Am I the only one? Can't be...  (Read 2823 times)

Offline Ox

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Am I the only one? Can't be...
« on: October 27, 2017, 08:51:41 AM »
Am I alone in hating edging boards on the mill?  I'll let flitches pile right up and then do them all at once if I can.  Most times it turns out all right but sometimes that one flitch will be pretty wide on one end and it'll come out ruined because it's in the middle of the pile and I don't see it soon enough.  True, more careful and diligent planning of this operation will save this one oddball board but I just hate doing it so much I chalk it up to "production speed losses" and forget about it!  The joke is I'm very slow sawmilling because everything is manual on the mill and I don't move too fast any more.
 I'm not like this with most things in my life but there's just something about edging.  All the handling, flipping, tiny little shavings of bark and sapwood breaking and falling all over the place in a mixed up jumble.....argh!  ::)
K.I.S.S. - Keep It Simple Stupid
Use it up, wear it out, make it do or do without
1989 GMC 3500 4x4 diesel dump and plow truck, 1964 Oliver 1600 Industrial with Parsons loader and backhoe, 1986 Zetor 5211, Cat's Claw sharpener, single tooth setter, homemade Linn Lumber 1900 style mill, old tools

Offline Rachiano

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Re: Am I the only one? Can't be...
« Reply #1 on: October 27, 2017, 10:12:33 AM »
I have been doing the same about 6 years ago for 3 years long until I got my hand on a wmeg50 edger. Have my eg50 for 3 years now and it still works good. Edging on the mill is a tedious task and you have lower recovery. A lot of usable wood becomes waste if edging on a mill. Most will say they have been doing it that way for years...but you will only know if you start working with an edger. For smaller manual push edgers you will need help. An edger when sawing production will pay for itself very soon.
Look for different makes and compare them...Cooks...WM...Baker...and recently read about an afordable Reihl edger. There may be some industrial used "beast heavy iron" edgers out there but many will require 3 phase power. An edger with a diesel engine would be a good choice.

Offline joasis

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Re: Am I the only one? Can't be...
« Reply #2 on: October 27, 2017, 12:37:06 PM »
I always edge on the mill...no big deal.

When I was a kid, we had a Belsaw edger, and it took more time to jack with it then stack and slice.
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Online bandmiller2

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Re: Am I the only one? Can't be...
« Reply #3 on: October 27, 2017, 07:52:46 PM »
I incorporate edging with my milling. When I'm cutting a cant I clamp boards that need edging to the cant so I don't have to make an extra cut. I don't (who does) like edging but it goes with milling. I find edging is easier on a circular mill. Frank C.

Offline furu

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Re: Am I the only one? Can't be...
« Reply #4 on: October 27, 2017, 09:24:39 PM »
I am not a great fan of edging on the mill but it is what I have to do as I do not have an edger. 
Thought about it but never pulled the trigger. 
I am certain that I am not very efficient the way I do it, as it seems to take forever.  I tend to make planting stakes out of a lot of the material until I get down to the really good stuff.  I can always use more planting stakes for my seedlings as can be seen below.

Integrity is not just doing the right thing.
Integrity is not just doing the right thing when no one is looking.
Integrity is doing the right thing when no one else will ever even know.

Offline Ox

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Re: Am I the only one? Can't be...
« Reply #5 on: October 28, 2017, 09:36:11 AM »
That's an impressive picture, furu.  What kind of seedlings are they?  I know you wrote about them elsewhere but I forget what you said.  Seems like several different kinds of pine/softwood if I remember right?.........this is a test for my brain bowl.........

I ran an edger a little at the sawmill down the road from me.  I can't remember the make but it almost looked like a very well built homemade machine.  It was so nice and easy to get the maximum width out of flitches.   

When I'm edging I usually try to lower the head 1" at a time to gain sticker material while I'm edging.  I try not to waste anything.  I even saw tree tops  out if I can get a 4x4 out of them.  Something that small kind of looks silly on the mill but waste makes me pucker and I don't have a huge woodlot so my resources are limited.  It's only a matter of time until I'll have to beg borrow or trade for saw logs.  It'll be several more years from now but it's coming.  Hopefully I can get done what I need by then. 
K.I.S.S. - Keep It Simple Stupid
Use it up, wear it out, make it do or do without
1989 GMC 3500 4x4 diesel dump and plow truck, 1964 Oliver 1600 Industrial with Parsons loader and backhoe, 1986 Zetor 5211, Cat's Claw sharpener, single tooth setter, homemade Linn Lumber 1900 style mill, old tools

Offline furu

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Re: Am I the only one? Can't be...
« Reply #6 on: October 28, 2017, 04:51:02 PM »
That's an impressive picture, furu.  What kind of seedlings are they?  I know you wrote about them elsewhere but I forget what you said.  Seems like several different kinds of pine/softwood if I remember right?.........this is a test for my brain bowl.........


The ones in that picture are Douglas fir and Western Red Cedar seedlings that I planted in the late winter/spring 2016. 
This past season, late winter/spring 2017, I planted Western White Pine and Ponderosa Pine but I don't think I have posted anything from this past year. 
I probably need to update that thread.  I don't think  many folks are into that side of things but I get great satisfaction out of replanting a new stand of forest.

I have several bylines that I use:

"The path to the future is through the forest...."

"The best time to plant a tree was 20 years ago. The next best time is now."

"Time spent amongst trees is never wasted time."


Don't feel  like you are the lone ranger about scrimping on logs.  I saw everything that I can get out of everything I have.  It takes/wastes a fair amount of time to get all that out but I am cheap (ah/er. frugal). 

When I go through 3000- 5000 stakes every year in planting, to hold the protection tubes to keep the bloody Mountain Beavers from clipping the seedlings, I am always needing stakes so I waste nothing.  The good news is my stakes are the same dimension size as my stickers so all is good one way or the other.  Length is the only difference.
Integrity is not just doing the right thing.
Integrity is not just doing the right thing when no one is looking.
Integrity is doing the right thing when no one else will ever even know.

Offline Ox

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Re: Am I the only one? Can't be...
« Reply #7 on: October 29, 2017, 09:16:01 AM »
That is just....awesome.  I really don't have the words, but I can say that you're a good, good man for doing what you're doing.  Most people out there don't give trees and forests a second thought.  I say let them wipe with their hands and then they'll start thinking.

Are your reforestation projects all on your own land?  Where do you get the seedlings?  Are there programs to help offset the costs of what you're doing or is it all on a personal level?
K.I.S.S. - Keep It Simple Stupid
Use it up, wear it out, make it do or do without
1989 GMC 3500 4x4 diesel dump and plow truck, 1964 Oliver 1600 Industrial with Parsons loader and backhoe, 1986 Zetor 5211, Cat's Claw sharpener, single tooth setter, homemade Linn Lumber 1900 style mill, old tools

Offline Stevem

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Re: Am I the only one? Can't be...
« Reply #8 on: October 29, 2017, 11:45:47 AM »
Quote
"The best time to plant a tree was 20 years ago. The next best time is now."

I like that!
Stevem
Because you can doesn't mean you should!

Offline furu

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Re: Am I the only one? Can't be...
« Reply #9 on: October 29, 2017, 01:09:40 PM »

Are your reforestation projects all on your own land?  Where do you get the seedlings?  Are there programs to help offset the costs of what you're doing or is it all on a personal level?

My reforestation used to be just in my own forest stands but I started up a small forestry services company this past year and am now doing work for others as well.

My seedlings come from several different sources but my favorite is the state DNR nursery.  They have really good quality stock.  Getting stock that comes from seeds from the correct seed zones is very important.  You can in limited cases use seeds from an adjacent similar zone but you can lose years and decades if you screw up.  I know of one case where they used the same species but from a zone that was significantly different.  The trees grew well for 20 years and then just died as they started to mature.  Lost two decades of time and growth.  Even though the same species there are variants that can only be determined by DNA testing  to see which they are.  It is very important to keep your seed sources well documented.

Yes there are programs that can help with cost share grants.  My area has several choices to help out small forest land owners.   
If it is a true commercial operation then they are not eligible for the grants. 
One of the grant programs that is nation wide is the USDA NRCS program that goes by the name EQIP. 

Whether you believe the government should be giving grants to private landowners for this purpose or not is another topic but under current federal law the grants exist, at least at this time.
Integrity is not just doing the right thing.
Integrity is not just doing the right thing when no one is looking.
Integrity is doing the right thing when no one else will ever even know.

Online bandmiller2

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Re: Am I the only one? Can't be...
« Reply #10 on: October 29, 2017, 02:26:28 PM »
Nothing makes you realize your own mortality more than planting trees. There is nothing more selfless than an old man planting trees. Frank C.

Offline furu

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Re: Am I the only one? Can't be...
« Reply #11 on: October 29, 2017, 03:41:12 PM »
Frank
 Are you calling me old. :) ;) :o


I, once upon a time, considered 70 old. 
That changed to 80 about 10 years ago. 
I now tell people that if you ask me in another 5 years then I will say you are not old until you are 90. 
I am sticking by that and it would not surprise me if in another 10 years or so I will not consider one old until they are 100.

I am still young inside. 
As long as you have a dream of where you want to go and what you want to do then you are never old.

I will never make it to final harvest of the trees I am currently planting (unless there is one heck of a medical breakthrough).  But I have a dream that I will make it to the point at which I see a commercial thinning.  A PCT will no doubt happen and will most likely be done by myself unless there is some horrible bad incident.
Integrity is not just doing the right thing.
Integrity is not just doing the right thing when no one is looking.
Integrity is doing the right thing when no one else will ever even know.

Offline Ox

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Re: Am I the only one? Can't be...
« Reply #12 on: October 30, 2017, 09:54:25 AM »
 :)
K.I.S.S. - Keep It Simple Stupid
Use it up, wear it out, make it do or do without
1989 GMC 3500 4x4 diesel dump and plow truck, 1964 Oliver 1600 Industrial with Parsons loader and backhoe, 1986 Zetor 5211, Cat's Claw sharpener, single tooth setter, homemade Linn Lumber 1900 style mill, old tools

Offline jb griffin

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Re: Am I the only one? Can't be...
« Reply #13 on: October 31, 2017, 08:08:25 PM »
2 saw edgers are awesome,  band mill edging SUCKS.
1.5 million bdft and counting sawn on a Baker Dominator
Lt40Hyd 33hp Kubota at home.

Offline Ox

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Re: Am I the only one? Can't be...
« Reply #14 on: October 31, 2017, 08:18:42 PM »
The one I ran a little was a two blade affair.  I liked it.  So easy to sight and line up.
K.I.S.S. - Keep It Simple Stupid
Use it up, wear it out, make it do or do without
1989 GMC 3500 4x4 diesel dump and plow truck, 1964 Oliver 1600 Industrial with Parsons loader and backhoe, 1986 Zetor 5211, Cat's Claw sharpener, single tooth setter, homemade Linn Lumber 1900 style mill, old tools

Offline terracefarmer

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Re: Am I the only one? Can't be...
« Reply #15 on: July 05, 2019, 07:40:58 PM »
I hate edging on the mill so much this past winter I bought an edger, but it didn't have an engine on it, so as of yet I've not used it.    This past week we're in the process of building a tractor PTO drive for it, am machining the parts right now, hope to have it up and running in the next week or so, depending on what the weather does.

If things work like they should, I'll never edge on the mill again.   

Offline Kojba

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Re: Am I the only one? Can't be...
« Reply #16 on: July 12, 2019, 05:53:40 PM »
I feel your pain, but if you're sawing for "Grade", then the length or width is often a non-issue for woodworkers who want quality lumber.  A four foot long #1 grade board, is often worth more than a 8 foot long #2 or 3.  It's worth it to cut off the knots, keep the board stacked and dry for resale.  Most of my "woodworking buyers", want clear lumber, and anything over 4 foot catches their eye.  Most want at least a 5/4 board (because of planing and sanding loss), and for cabinets etc., length is no big deal.
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Offline A.O.

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Re: Am I the only one? Can't be...
« Reply #17 on: July 14, 2019, 04:49:10 PM »
My reforestation used to be just in my own forest stands but I started up a small forestry services company this past year and am now doing work for others as well.

Yes there are programs that can help with cost share grants.  My area has several choices to help out small forest land owners.   
If it is a true commercial operation then they are not eligible for the grants. 
One of the grant programs that is nation wide is the USDA NRCS program that goes by the name EQIP. 

Whether you believe the government should be giving grants to private landowners for this purpose or not is another topic but under current federal law the grants exist, at least at this time.

We did a cedar eradication on 160 acres I had in Oklahoma with the EQIP program. Sure wish I had my little sawmill then!!!!

Offline moodnacreek

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Re: Am I the only one? Can't be...
« Reply #18 on: July 14, 2019, 09:07:47 PM »
T. farmer, you may have to edge certain things on the mill. Many times edgers will not cut straight by themselves. Feedroll edgers take experience to operate and do a good job. On mine there is 4 feed speeds and an overhead shadow guide lite and I can do acceptable work most times but big ugly stuff goes back on the carriage.