How Long Do We Have?

[Kirk Allen]

How Long Do We Have?
About the time our original thirteen states adopted their new constitution in 1787, Alexander Tyler, a Scottish history professor at the University of Edinburgh , had this to say about the fall of the Athenian Republic ( Athens ) some 2,000 years earlier:

'A democracy is always temporary in nature; it simply cannot exist as a permanent form of government.'
'A democracy will continue to exist up until the time that voters discover they can vote themselves generous gifts from the public treasury.'
'From that moment on, the majority always vote for the candidates who promise the most benefits from the public treasury, with the result that every democracy will finally collapse due to loose fiscal policy, which is always followed by a dictatorship'
'The average age of the world's greatest civilizations from the beginning of history, has been about 200 years'
'During those 200 years, those nations always progressed through the following sequence:

1. from bondage to spiritual faith;
2. from spiritual faith to great courage;
3. from courage to liberty;
4. from liberty to abundance;
5. from abundance to complacency;
6. from complacency to apathy;
7. from apathy to dependence;
8. from dependence back into bondage'

Professor Joseph Olson of Hemline University School of Law,  St. Paul ,   Minnesota , points out some interesting facts concerning the 2000  Presidential election:

Number of States won by: Democrats: 19 Republicans: 29
Square miles of land won by: Democrats: 580,000 Republicans: 2,427,000
Population of counties won by: Democrats: 127 million Republicans: 143 million
Murder rate per 100,000 residents in counties won by: Democrats: 13.2 Republicans: 2.1
 
Professor Olson adds: 'In aggregate, the map of the territory Republican won was mostly the land owned by the taxpaying citizens of this great country. Democrat territory mostly encompassed those citizens living in government-owned tenements and living off various forms of government welfare...' Olson believes the United States is now somewhere between the 'complacency and apathy' phase of Professor Tyler's definition of democracy, with some forty percent of the nation's population already having reached the 'governmental dependency' phase.

If Congress grants amnesty and citizenship to twenty million criminal invaders called illegal's and they vote, then we can say goodbye to the USA  in fewer than five years.

If you are in favor of this, then by all means, delete this message. If you are not, then pass this along to help everyone realize just how much is at stake, knowing that apathy is the greatest danger to our freedom.
 
WE LIVE IN THE LAND OF THE FREE, ONLY BECAUSE OF THE BRAVE

[mike p]

IM afraid after the next 4 years Old USA will never be the same
how long ?
the time is near
a Assembly God buddy of mine says they beleve obama is part of the book of revelation
i asked him were in revelation & he sayed read it & you will see

[Stevem]

A couple of points but first:

I share your concern for our country, maybe more, but then I'm sometimes thought of as a worry wort.

Points:

1.  We don't have a Democracy!  A Democracy is a nice name for mob rule. The word does not appear even once in The Constitution.  We do use democratic principals in elections.  What we have is a Republic, a government of laws supposedly equally applied to all.  The founding fathers were very adamant about that choice.  Democracies don't work.  Think of the French Revolution as an example. 

2.  Though I like the words of the Alexander Tyler reference there is no academic proof that he ever said it.

3  Reference from Professor Olson web site:
DISCLAIMER: There is an e-mail floating around the internet dealing with the 2000 Bush/Gore election, remarks of a Scotish philosopher named Alexander Tyler, etc. Part of it is attributed to me. It is entirely BOGUS as to my authorship. I've been trying to kill it siince December 2000. For details see: http://www.snopes.com/politics/quotes/tyler.asp

The closest thing I'm aware of is the Dynastic Cycle which is about a 200 year cycle, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dynastic_cycle
One thing the reference doesn't mention is the degradation of the infrastructure during the decline (irrigation systems in particular) and the part where the "new Ruler" eliminates the old system at sword point, even to rounding up the land lords, separating them from their heads and redistributing the land to the common people.  Leaders that claim having a "Mandate" scare me!

The root of our current problem, in my opinion, is found in the "New Deal" where government took on the roll of fixing things instead of letting the people and the economic system work things out.  Several presidents, prior to Roosevelt, flat turned down legislation for charity or helping a particular group with grants on the grounds that there is no provision in The Constitution that allows government to do that. Government spending now accounts for over 30% of our Gross domestic Product where as in 1900 it was closer to 10%.
Deficit spending is the current biggest sin committed by our leaders but the roots go back to the New Deal.  (a side note is one of the reasons we HAVEN'T had more wars in history is because government didn't have the money to pay for it.  Now you can just put it on your VISA card.

The Founding Fathers were knowledgeable and had done their homework on political systems.  And what they wrote was good and enduring.  What they wrote was pretty unique.  Government derives it's powers with the consent of the people.  I've had a Congressman, in public, refer me to someone else if I wanted to argue Constitutional law because we were very far from it that it was a moot point. (and now was 20 years ago).

Regan had it right, "Government can't fix the problem, government is the problem."

enough

[joasis]

The mentality of many Americans has been conditioned to want more and accept more....from the government. They want cradle to the grave care, and don't care how it gets there. Personal responsibility is a covenant of the conservative Republicans...and actually, conservatives in general....and it has taken leave this last election.

Lets hope and [ray that 2 years from now, mid terms, conservatives begin to take control again, before it is too late.

BTW Steve...dead on accurate about the New Deal....the beginning of American Socialism.

[mike p]

the constution was written buy top thinkers of the day & is a very good goverment plan
its a lot better that the goverment we got now

[Stevem]

The point that joasis makes is one I think we need to keep in the forefront of any dialog.  Conservatives come in all sorts of colors and political leaning not just associated with a particular party.  I've got a sister-in-law that's conservative but she's a proud Democrate.  Gets real upset being accused of liberal thinking because of her political party.

If conservative thinkers are ever going to have an influence on political thinking they (we?) need to look at what is agreed on not the differences.  People need more information on just what our government is spending money on to curb the ridiculous.  Questions need to be asked like: "Are you willing to pay for my child's education?" or "Will you pay for the research in Australia to make sniff tests of the native population?" or even  "Will you pay for the support of some African dictator who is starving his own people to death?"

I really think if we knew half of what our government spends money on the people would revolt.  Just cut the spin they put on most programs. 
We are the frog, the water is about to boil and nodbody seems to know it or want to hear it.

The UN just spent $23 million on ceiling art and we pay dues to that organization?
I'm just trying to get the coin together to paint my house, jeees.