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Author Topic: Why do you saw mill?  (Read 16776 times)

Offline Stevem

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Why do you saw mill?
« on: February 12, 2008, 12:04:25 PM »
I don't think I've ever sen a thread on on the "Why" of this business if it is even a business to you.  We often get caught up in the "What's the best sawmill" question but that assumes a need and reason to have a mill in the first place.
So I'm asking, "Why do you saw mill?" 
I've just felt compelled to ask myself that question and would be interesed in other peoples reasons.

My reason is to take a resource, logs in this case, headed to the waste bin and turn them into a useful product for somebody. Or turn a low use product, firewood or chips, into a high use product like furniture or structures.  Profit is not high on MY list of priorities as long as I don't go broke, but it is for some.   It's what ever flips your skirt up.  No right or wrong answers. 
I kind of view people on this board as more or less living in a sub culture.  It strikes me as groupe of people that I can relate to and share at least some of basic principals and values with.  Kinda modern day hippies going against the tide of big business.  Labor wise there's lots of easier ways to generate income with a lot less hasseles.
Be interesting to see what your thoughts are.   

Stevem
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Offline Kirk Allen

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Re: Why do you saw mill?
« Reply #1 on: February 12, 2008, 12:28:19 PM »
For me it started out as a means to building a Timber Frame vacation home.  Although that project is still pending, the addiction has taken over and we mill regularly now.  What was only a personal hobby quickly grew to a part time business as well as mission work. 

We routinly cut for the sake of being able to help those who cant afford the lumber they need to take care of simple things at home like replacing boards in a floor, or steps for a rotted out porch.  Just last week we were able to provide the needed floor joists for a family that simply could not afford it.  Considering most of our timber comes to us for free, its our way of sharing that blessing. 

On the business side of it, we literally fell into a niche business of providing the best Osage Orange in the world. The sales from that alone with the few custom cutting jobs we do provides extra cash to take some of life's pressures off. 

It has truly become an addiction and as a wood worker, its really nice to have the mill around as there is nothing handier to rip a long board than a sawmill ;D

Now with the Biomizer sawdust burner coming I have yet another reason to make sawdust.  ;D
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Offline mike p

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Re: Why do you saw mill?
« Reply #2 on: February 12, 2008, 03:19:11 PM »
well i got some free advise from state forester on my walnut trees around 2002 & he had me join the certified tree farm system it came with tree farm magizine there i read about Paul Easly in ill he's a sawmiller , retailer of hardwoods etc....
we went to see his operation later that year he told me how he became a millionaire as a sawmiller/ salesman of Kasco mills & sold me on the idea of a sawmillers lifestyle. well a lot happened in the next 2 years to us & i sold my 28 acres, bought a Kasco mill & moved 125miles south to a 5 acre plot on dads 160 acre farm,110 acres of it in timber .as he is/ was on oxgen all the time & not able to care for the farm anymore. we had a lot of trees down due to tornado & i planned to mill them up & make my fortune. during the loading of furniture to move in 04 i had my
1st heart atack, so the first time i got to use my mill was after recouping
   i soon learned that green oak doesnt sell & my health consummed my kiln 's nest egg so i am running several years behind the dream but its still there.
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Offline JP Sinclair

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Re: Why do you saw mill?
« Reply #3 on: February 13, 2008, 09:18:16 AM »
Initially the mill was only to supplement the logging business.  I had the idea I could turn out some framing timber in the spring when it was too muddy to go into the woods.  Then slowly over the course of the next 5 years, business for the mill kept going up and up.  Eventually, got some good customers with open orders and it became apparent that I should sell the logging side and go into the millwork. 

Offline mike p

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Re: Why do you saw mill?
« Reply #4 on: February 13, 2008, 10:45:15 AM »
I MILL
to see what nature is hiding within the log
to save a tree from to firewood pile
to get lumber
cause im adicted to the aroma of oak
Eagle's Nest Tree farm & Sawmill
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My reading of history convinces me that most bad government results from
 too much government.
   Thomas Jefferson 1802
 No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms.

   Thomas Jefferson

Offline Kirk Allen

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Re: Why do you saw mill?
« Reply #5 on: February 19, 2008, 09:39:24 PM »
Mike, That first reason is the very reason I could not make a living full time cutting lumber.  Each and every board is unique and I have to spend time looking at it and thinking about all the great things I could make out of if.  ;D

Cant make a living if I am spending all my time staring at the grain :D
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Offline JP Sinclair

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Re: Why do you saw mill?
« Reply #6 on: February 20, 2008, 10:23:05 AM »
Sad reality isn't it?.  I kept opening up figured logs and being mesmerized by what I saw.  I would stash the REALLY cool stuff in my own private pile.  Pretty soon I realized half my inventory was there...Plus I made the mistake of pulling a few pieces out for some woodworking customers, now they ask about the "private stock"

Offline Kirk Allen

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Re: Why do you saw mill?
« Reply #7 on: February 20, 2008, 10:48:11 AM »
 Man can I relate to that JP.  My private stash became quite an inventory and like you, I screwed up and shared some of it ONE time and now you know the rest of the story. :laugh:

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Offline JP Sinclair

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Re: Why do you saw mill?
« Reply #8 on: February 20, 2008, 02:36:33 PM »
I even resorted to a Super Private stock.  But the dirty buggers would stop by the shop to shoot the bull and you could see the eyes searching around in the corners.  I need a nice underground spot, kind of like a wine cellar!.  Of course a fist full of dollars has a way of winning me over every time for the good stuff...

Offline John Bartley

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Re: Why do you saw mill?
« Reply #9 on: February 23, 2008, 09:33:54 AM »
Six+ years ago I sold my small engine business to my partner. I worked for him for 5+ years while he got organised and then last fall I quit (on good terms) and needed something to do to keep me active. The part of running my own business that I enjoyed most was starting and building it. After it got off the ground it became a job. So....I have always wanted my own mill anyway, and this was one way to own my own mill and also see how the business of milling would go. I started during the worst winter for snow we've had for years, and business hasn't even started yet, but I've given myself a year to see if I can achieve my goal of working 10-15 billable hours each week for the first real year. After that....we'll see I guess.

cheers eh?

Offline joasis

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Re: Why do you saw mill?
« Reply #10 on: February 23, 2008, 07:18:06 PM »
10 to 15 hours a week? You must be semi retired.....If I could mill 2 days a week, I don't know if I could think of it as a job. I hope it goes well John.

In the woodworking topic, I posted pictures of the rocking horses I made from red cedar I felled, milled, and used....it is a thrill to know you took a project from tree to finish, without a lumber yard in sight. I build cedar chests for gifts, and this year I hope to have 2 grandfather clocks completed, from walnut that I also milled.
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Offline Kirk Allen

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Re: Why do you saw mill?
« Reply #11 on: February 23, 2008, 08:49:39 PM »
John I am looking forward to the day when I can mill a couple days a week....................without any other business to take up my time. 
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Offline John Bartley

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Re: Why do you saw mill?
« Reply #12 on: February 24, 2008, 07:00:50 AM »
Hi guys,

Thank you for the comments.

Yes, you're correct, I am semi-retired, but at 50, I'm too young to take a "peaceful" part time job  :laugh:. I enjoy being outside and working physically. However, having been in business before, I have experienced the labour overload of success, and I'd really rather not be working 50-75 hours per week again. I also don't want my part time cutting to negatively affect anyone locally who makes a living at the milling business. To help accomplish that, I've only advertised lightly and have set my hourly cutting rate quite high ($25/hr transport - $75/hr cutting - NO $/board foot cutting), with the idea that at those rates the revenue will be high enough to permit me to do a top quality job without going broke (spend some free time with the customer discussing the job/cleaning up/organising the worksite etc.), allow me to keep the equipment in excellent (safe and reliable) condition, and also deter those customers who are looking for bargain basement deals to have crappy wood cut. If my rates are too high ..... I guess I'll still have my mill to play with, I can work at something else, and someone else can finance their customers life-style by working cheap :).

cheers eh?

Offline The WoodButcher

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Re: Why do you saw mill?
« Reply #13 on: March 04, 2008, 02:13:38 PM »
Hi All, I run my sawmill cause I Can  ;D My mill operation is the life the Lord gave me in return for my old life that I gave Him. I never wanted a sawmill,........Until I turned my life over to Him. Then one day  I saw one on line and just had to have one. I couldn't afford one by my self, and one day at work I ran into this guy and he turned me back to Jesus, since then he has become my 2nd best friend. He went halves on the mill with me, 1 1/2 years later he shows up with a forklift and says, here ya go, you need one of these. He is half owner of all of it and he acts as though he wants nothing to do with it. I run my mill as if it was "my mill". He's a real silent partner. I do think we met by God's devine intervention.  I have said it before and I'm saying it again, I am Blessed By The Best.

BTW the job that I met this guy on, was when we were building the Billy Graham library in Charlotte NC. I ran the crane on this job. This is a steel building wraped with big (Rough Sawn) wood.




« Last Edit: March 04, 2008, 02:23:27 PM by The WoodButcher »
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Offline joasis

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Re: Why do you saw mill?
« Reply #14 on: March 04, 2008, 05:37:43 PM »
Looks like the forklift is now part of your family. :)
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Offline Mark

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Re: Why do you saw mill?
« Reply #15 on: March 13, 2008, 05:42:59 PM »
OOoooohhh Man! It all started with a Turkey Call.....where I live now Wild Turkey Hunting is the thang....after leaving S.Fla after 36yrs of blissful hibernation I had to find some new things to do(this is going to be impossible to keep short).I'm a finish carpenter by trade so wood crafts and furniture have always been a desire.S.Fla doesn't have a venue for the hardwoods we all love and choose to work with,and I couldn't afford the real estate that would provide a shop and room to build so it never happened.When I moved here the "woodbug" got me real bad and I put my shop together.Sold alot of equipment I no longer needed and put in the shop essentials,TS,router&table,planer,Bandsaw and chest's and chest's of my fav hand tools.Well,I also became a novice hunter about this time.Coming from S.fla I exchanged the fully automatic weapons for guns to hunt with and while online shopping for turkey calls one day I emailed this guy in Arkansas named Wendell Rye.He's a custom Turkey call maker and we kinda befriended each other.My questions quickly led to picking his mind senseless til I had enough info to start turning my own calls.During this process I learned things about wood that I never knew.Figure?What the hell is figure?I knew nothing of the such until I tore apart a piece of Blk.Walnut,emailed the pic to my buddy to find out that yes in fact is was curly and "NO' it doesn't happen in every tree and species.It's like finding and faceting a gem.Well,I'm not a wasteful person so I don't tear into log's looking for it but I do find it often.
With the building industry taking a "cerebral hit" this past year and even when it was good, fighting for my money and spending more time in court fileing judgments just became old news real fast.After 23 yrs. of cultivating my craft (licensed by the state of florida for 15 of 'em)I was no longer "happy" and I needed to stop feeling like I was paying a debt to society and do something abit more fulfilling.So back to the shop I went bought a vertical bandsaw so I could resaw some short logs in the shop and make my calls.Well,you can only make so much money selling turkey calls on ebay and even though my calls were in high demand,I couldn't make enough of them.I didn't want this to become a job cause I feared it wouldn't be fun anymore so I went down to the local sawmill "Buckhorn Lumber" and started asking ????Now,I was buying alot of exotic woods via the internet and I noticed something.How much money some of these guys were making.Not a killing but definitely enough to get by.I figured if I could get enough of a sought after species and auction it off at youknowwhere ,that I could fill a gap in my life.That gap was the ability to provide for my family.When you become worth more dead than alive at my age....something is wrong so I quickly went to work,I wasn't just going to sell a board here and a board there.I wanted to sell enough wood for a guy to complete a project so I put out 12-20bft packs with a starting bid and quickly realized how a species that grew like wildfire here that I paid $1.50bft for would sell for 10-15 times that on the internet if it was marketed to the right crowd.Now,I was paying the Sawmill for the wood,I was paying to transport it to the dryer,I was paying to transport it back to my place where I would cut the best parts from the boards,plane them and S4S.My collaboration was to sell the packs with a 100% yield rate for the end user.No endchecks,no planing unless for thickness. and KD'ed to boot.I accidently tapped into a niche market that was not prepared for.My supply quickly ran out and the sawmill was not quite as reluctant to slow down the 35 man crew to look for funky grained and high figured hardwoods for me without a cost so it became apparent that I needed a Portable Sawmill.All I had to do was convince my wife that this is good.She didn't care for the $10,000 price tag but she's always suppored me knowing how hard I've worked for us all these yrs.(20 of 'em)Well,I bought the mill in Jan. and my intent is to get my inventory up and cater to the Artisan,Craftand Hobby niche online and through a local retail business.Everyone in my area has a hobby.This place is loaded with bowl turners and carvers.It's a haven for something like this.So,I bought the mill first and have been cuttin' and stickerin' ever since.Now don't get me wrong,I've done things and failed before.That doesn't scare me.What scares me is if I don't even try.Thats failure.Some people have a knack for things and some don't,you know.But I know one thing,I had my mill made with a 16hp Vangaurd engine(the most HP they would put on it)and the High speed deck package for portability.My mill has been sawing everyday since mid Jan.and hasn't left my back nine yet.Another thing that surprised me is how many people stop and buy when they see the mill.They literally came outta the woodwork.
Anyway,I'm sorry to get so long winded over this but I'm passionate about it and don't believe I coulda left it at"it all started with a Turkey Call"    Mark

Offline Stevem

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Re: Why do you saw mill?
« Reply #16 on: March 13, 2008, 10:09:14 PM »
Mark,

I heard someone once say the key to success was to find something you love to do and then find someone willing to pay you to do it. 

Sounds like you qualify.

Welcome to the forum.

Steve
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Offline Mark

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Re: Why do you saw mill?
« Reply #17 on: March 13, 2008, 10:21:29 PM »
thanks Steve! I really didn't mean to write a book about it but the fact of the matter is I'm passionate about it and I do NEED to earn a living.You mentioned those of us  doing it for $$ and I'm not shy....I'll make as much as the local and ecommerce industry will allow.I'm not in it to get rich off one man and I do think it's a good and honest way to make a living.There are some real shiester's in this (and every) business though and thats why I believe strongly about being educated in the field.I would give that advice to anyone,,,,,"stop learning and stop living" ,Thanks again for the warm welcome,  Mark

Offline Frank Pender - AKA "Tail Gunner"

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Re: Why do you saw mill?
« Reply #18 on: March 24, 2008, 10:00:00 AM »
Well, Mark, you have motivated me to begin my story.

Things began around 60 years ago.  My father began a retail/wholesale lumber company, East of Portland, Oregon.  Oftentimes I would be placed in the front seat of his '49 Studebaker pickup (without seatbelts or car seats) and head for one or several outlineing sawmills.  One such mill was the Koch Sawmill in the community of Sandy, located in foothills of Mt. Hood.  Often times we would leave the main highway and head down a switchback road that was all gravel.  The road had no trees to speak of hiding it from the mill below.  Layed out before us would be hundreds of piles of lumber of various lengths but usually of only one height, about 4 feet.  The mill had about 5 or 6 straddle carriers or "Jitneys" that would haul the lumber from the green chain site to the storage areas. 

Coming down off of the hill and seeing the "Jitneys" scurring around like some oversized ants was a great site.  One day, one of the drivers had pulled up to the main office about the time we arrived.  I looked in awe at the machine.  The dirver said to me, "Ya want a ride, kiddo?"  Obviously I yelled, "Yes!"  Some might say that the res was history.

While the years passed on, each visit to the Koch mill brought on more and exciting adventures, tours of the mill, office visits with my father the Mr. Koch, etc.  The one thing that stays the longest is the rides.  It got to point that the drivers of the "jitneys" were having races to office parking lot to see who would get to take me for a ride.  What a thrill for all of those 7 or 8 years.

Forward some years of happenings.  I changed from visiting the mills to a 25 acre farm that my folks purchased, but we never moved to or built a home.  I did get to play cowboy from 12 to 24.  When I sold out I was running up to 150 head of cattle in a feedlot approach and loved every minute of it.

I had gone to college and decided to herd kids rather than cows.  I sold all of the walking stalk and moved to the central part of the Willamette Valley to begin a 30 year teaching carreer.  All this time I had not forgotten the roots of my being and continued to work with wood and in the woods.

I began sawing firewood on some friends tree farms and eventually ran into my wife, Alice.  On our first date we went for  walk on her tree farm and in the woods high on a hill amongst a stand of 130' tall Douglas Fir, I looked up in the trees and asked her to marry me.  She looked up in the trees and said, "Yes!"

For the first two years of out marriage we would often live out at a friends tree farm, about 20 miles away, in a two cabin tent and cut firewood. This lasted to another two years after the land was preped for replanting and the tent fun. I continued producing some firewood from the home place, but not the 100 cords a year, like before.

About fifteen years ago we had gone on a tree tour across the Valley and lo and behold there was a fella there that was running a sawmill.  I watched him for about 3 hours.  On the way home I said to Alice, my wife, "Lets sell the house in Monmouth and buy a mill?"  To my good fortune she said "Yes!"  Unbeknowns to me at the time, it was her way of getting out of feeling obligated to help in the firewood end of the farm business.

Now I can say the rest is history.  I have owned three different Mobile Dimension mill, I have a 52" head rig that I do not operate any more, and an Ocar 36 for making mantle pieces and slabbing shorter logs as well as Maple Burl.

I have been sawing for about 15 years now and it is still a great experience to open a log and see what mother nature has to offer the eye.

There mmay be more later.

The more later

As of late, I have discovered that I have a very deep want to see what is beyond the bark of a tree.  The figure, character, grain pattern, coloring, etc..  Then comes the use of the wood and to see it in place, in the form of furniture, flooring, a whole house. bed of a truck or lowboy trailer, and in some cases carvings and marquary.  It is a great feeling to see what others have done with something you have helped produce up to a certain point, while another takes what you have produced to another level.

« Last Edit: March 30, 2008, 02:43:38 PM by Frank Pender »

Offline The WoodButcher

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Re: Why do you saw mill?
« Reply #19 on: April 07, 2008, 04:15:06 PM »
Yeah, it don't take long to get spoiled joasis. I'd be totally lost without it now. That didn't take long did it ;D Couple of months. ::)
Thanks The WoodButcher
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